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"Hey"
Posted by bananapop 30 June  at  21:49

Hi

The morning after pill failed for me aswell, still very mad about it. Anyway, I had an abortion at 8.5 weeks aswell (well 7 if you count the exact day i got pregnant on)

I arranged mine through the family planning aswell but they can't tell you which one you'll have because it's up to the hospital. It was at my consultation they told what I'd be having. Have you had this and got the date? They should have ran through what was going to happen if you have, offered you counselling, blood tests, scan etc.

Once I'd had my consultation I got an appointment for the next week (as they only did them once every 2 weeks at this hospital and that was the next time but again depends on the hospital) but then because of problems with my schedule and the hospitals it got put back another 2 weeks (and then it got put back 2 days when they decided I should have a surgical) so I had to wait nearly 3.5 weeks but according to the nurse it was a very long time to wait so you shouldn't have too..if your going through the NHS anyway..privatly I don't think you have to wait at all.

At first they decided that I would have a medical abortion. Basically you take a pill (or maybe more than one I'm not sure) and then 2 days later you go back and take more. You then start to bleed heavily and have (from what I've read) very painful cramps and through that the pregnancy ends. But with this theres a chance you'll see the fetus. If you have it on the NHS you'll stay in the hospital for it.

But after problems with the hospital they decided I would have the surgical abortion (partly because they thought I would be too far gone for a medical so it might be the same as you) Here I got put to sleep and had it done that way. I'm glad I had it this way. I didn't get given anti biotics. I left the hospital afew hours later once I had eaten (I've started a thread on it called "my experience" which explains better)

To be honest once the aneasthetic (which was v.quick) had worn off I felt fine, I wasn't in bad pain and I was only bleeding very lightly. If I were you I'd take the next day off.
I don't know if you'll be ok to run but I had my abortion on the wednesday and moved house on the friday and was fine. But you might still be bleeding at the run..

Emotionally well.. The first few days after it honestly felt like nothing had happened and I was happy I could just get on with life now and not have to worry or cry anymore. But then for about 2 days I really did feel like the worst person alive, so much guilt and "what ifs" but I woke up on the 3rd day and realised I had made the right decision for me at the time and right now I dont feel bad about it. There will always be "what ifs" though.

It is a horrendous place to find yourself and there will be people who try and make you feel bad (especially people on here!)but it's your life and will never ever affect them by what you do.

Sorry look how much I've gone on, Hope I've answered everything but if not I'm happy to answer anything else.

Good luck xx

Whole thread for the following message:

Thread started by:
"Information- what to expect after abortion?"
Posted by harddecision 30 June  at  17:19

Hi,

I found this site from google and am pleased I did. I have yet to find a forum dedicated to the impossible decision of abortion and it's great to see positive posts about it.

I'm booked in to have an abortion on 10th July. By then i'll be 8.5 weeks gone (i know the exact date as there was a contraception disaster and i had to take the morning after pill- so am guessing that's when i got pregnant)....

But, as I'm getting it done through my local family planning clinic, I haven't been told which type of abortion I'm going to have and what would be the basic run through? I'm guessing I see the doctor, get signed off for the abortion and then wait around a bit?

Could anyone give me the basics of both the pill and the surgical options? By this i mean, will I have to take antibiotics after the operation? Will I need the next day off work? Also, I know it sounds like a ridiculous thing to be worried about but i'm due to do a charity run the following week (10km)- is this likely or am I physically going to be shattered? Although, I'm been so tired since I got pregnant, I've barely trained...

I realise I'll have a whole load of emotional issues either way to deal with as well but really i'm interested to know the toll it may (or may not) have on my body.

I am also well aware that there are other options to abortion but I have made my decision. It's horrendous and I wish I felt I had another option but I really don't feel like I do....

Thanks

xxx
 
Replies:
 
Messages:
"Hey"
Posted by bananapop 30 June  at  21:49

Hi

The morning after pill failed for me aswell, still very mad about it. Anyway, I had an abortion at 8.5 weeks aswell (well 7 if you count the exact day i got pregnant on)

I arranged mine through the family planning aswell but they can't tell you which one you'll have because it's up to the hospital. It was at my consultation they told what I'd be having. Have you had this and got the date? They should have ran through what was going to happen if you have, offered you counselling, blood tests, scan etc.

Once I'd had my consultation I got an appointment for the next week (as they only did them once every 2 weeks at this hospital and that was the next time but again depends on the hospital) but then because of problems with my schedule and the hospitals it got put back another 2 weeks (and then it got put back 2 days when they decided I should have a surgical) so I had to wait nearly 3.5 weeks but according to the nurse it was a very long time to wait so you shouldn't have too..if your going through the NHS anyway..privatly I don't think you have to wait at all.

At first they decided that I would have a medical abortion. Basically you take a pill (or maybe more than one I'm not sure) and then 2 days later you go back and take more. You then start to bleed heavily and have (from what I've read) very painful cramps and through that the pregnancy ends. But with this theres a chance you'll see the fetus. If you have it on the NHS you'll stay in the hospital for it.

But after problems with the hospital they decided I would have the surgical abortion (partly because they thought I would be too far gone for a medical so it might be the same as you) Here I got put to sleep and had it done that way. I'm glad I had it this way. I didn't get given anti biotics. I left the hospital afew hours later once I had eaten (I've started a thread on it called "my experience" which explains better)

To be honest once the aneasthetic (which was v.quick) had worn off I felt fine, I wasn't in bad pain and I was only bleeding very lightly. If I were you I'd take the next day off.
I don't know if you'll be ok to run but I had my abortion on the wednesday and moved house on the friday and was fine. But you might still be bleeding at the run..

Emotionally well.. The first few days after it honestly felt like nothing had happened and I was happy I could just get on with life now and not have to worry or cry anymore. But then for about 2 days I really did feel like the worst person alive, so much guilt and "what ifs" but I woke up on the 3rd day and realised I had made the right decision for me at the time and right now I dont feel bad about it. There will always be "what ifs" though.

It is a horrendous place to find yourself and there will be people who try and make you feel bad (especially people on here!)but it's your life and will never ever affect them by what you do.

Sorry look how much I've gone on, Hope I've answered everything but if not I'm happy to answer anything else.

Good luck xx
"From someone who is trying to make you feel bad"
Posted by gaelfish 1 July  at  10:36

Dear Harddecision,

Well no, I am not trying to make you feel bad, but I am pretty well informed about abortion and its consequences. Seeing as you are still pregnant, and your baby is still alive I figure it is worth a shot to tell you the other side of the abortion story. This will always hurt post abortive women and make them pretty angry, and I am sorry for that, but you did ask, and you might as well be fully informed.

Effects on you.
http://www.abortionbreastcancer.com/abc.html
If you have never brought a pregnancy to full term, then you do significantly increase your risk of breast cancer with this termination. The reason your boobs get sore at the beginning of the pregnancy is that they start to grow and change to produce milk. They go through 4 stages of development, and if you cut the development due to an abortion then your breast cells are unstable and this is an optimum enviornment for cancerous cells to grow. I am talking about cancer in the 30-40 year age group, not the post menopausal kind. This link is being disputed by pro-choice people, people with clear vested interests, but if you look closely enough at the studies they use, then you will see they are using dirty tricks to try to pull the wool over your eyes.

Emotional

Well some women on here will write back after a few hours or days after the procedure and say all is well, best decision ever, etc etc.

The thing is that this is a decision for life. You will take your guilt about this to the grave, and will have to be continuously justifying to yourself that you did the right thing, whereas really deep down you know this is pretty hard to justify. That sounds like really hard work. There have been many studies on post abortive stress, and if you want to be really informed then have a look at http://www.abortionfacts.com

For me the breast cancer and the mental stress after are the biggies. I think it is a bit shortsighted to say that abortion is none of anyones business except the mother involved. By playing God, you might be extinguishing the life of the next Mozart, the next scientist who finds a cure for cancer, my child's soul mate, who knows? You are changing future history, and that is everybody's business.

I dont get my kicks from making women who are in a crisis pregnancy feel bad, the thing is that I do care about your baby, strange as it may seem, I do care about you and I dont want you to go through the hell on earth which is aborion and its consequences.

Siobhan

xx
"Disgusting!"
Posted by istaone 3 July  at  01:35

I have been reading this forum for a while now and I have to say I am absolutley disgusted by the last reply. So much so I joined so I could write this!

There is NO PROVEN LINK with abortion and breast cancer (What about women who have lost the baby naturally - Are you saying they are more likely to get cancer? No you would not do that! So it is not fair to do it in anycase!!!) of course pro-life sites are going to say that!

You say pro - choice people use dirty tricks. Well I have to say that that is the lowest dirtiest trick anyone could use! (and abortionfacts.com is not fact! it is the idea of the writer! I wonder why you never post links to purely medical sites that have no leaning to either side??) You are saying pro-choice people have vested interests by proving not - so do pro-lifers by saying there is a link!!

You obviously get a kick from writing things like that - making a distressed person more upset is low! It shows you up too be a pretty vile person - and not the supportive helpful person you want to come across.

You say you know so much then do some research outside of the pro-life bubble. Look at sites where people do not regret it, medical sites with no hidden agenda on the issue. It might give you a more full view on it.

You care so much about children - maybe you should be focusing your efforts on those already born who need help.

It is none of your business! Your just trying to justify to yourself what you are doing is right. You wouldn't appreciate anyone trying to get involved with your life, marriage or childs life because they thought it was their business too.

Oh and things can be twisted both ways - someone could have just aborted a future serial child rapist.

Not everyone has the life of guilt afterwards. The same as not every pro-lifer blows up abortion clinics and murders the doctors!! I am not saying that people skip away from it singing happy songs. But not everyone reacts to the same to situations or are affected in the same ways. But I am guessing pro-life sites don't tell you this.

I have not had an abortion or even been in that situation. But it is not for me or ANYONE to judge and purposefully try to scare someone who is/was!





"No proven link? ok some purely medical sites..."
Posted by gaelfish 3 July  at  10:59

Ok so below is a list of the scientific studies which show a very big link between abortion and breast cancer, and no, they are not all catholic scaremongerers....Dr Dahling is a pro choice woman who was very surprised to find a link, if you want to do a bit more research.

Miscarriage in the first trimester has no effect on elevated breast cancer risk; if you get into it you can read why, but basically because the body did not produce enough hormones to sustain the pregnancy, and because the body dealt naturally with the miscarriage this does not effect the breasts.

In two states in the US, I think it is Tenessee and Kansas there is a health warning in the abortion clinics to the effect that there is a link.

Dear Istaone, Id say you are trying to protect someone close to you who has had an abortion, and that is understandable, or else you work in the 'industry', but with all the passion and anger this one cuts closer to the bone than you would like to admit.

Every woman has a right to know the risks of abortion, and I think we are big girls here, and we can take the truth. No?

So what about all those pink ribbons? Raising money for Breast cancer is big business, The Susan Coleman foundation is the biggest fundraiser, and guess what, they give something like 25% of their revenue to Planned Parenthood, who preform about 90% of all abortions in America. So I wonder why they havent found a link yet....


XX
Siobhan



Studies Which Reported More Than a Twofold Elevation in risk

M. Segi, et al "An Epidemiological Study on Cancer in Japan," GANN, Vol. 48, Supplement: April, 1957. (abstract not available)

Pike et al (1981) Br Journal of Cancer 43 Oral contraceptive use and early abortion as risk factors for breast cancer in young women

Nishiyama (1982) Shikoku Ichi 38: 333-43 (In Japanese)

Laing et al (1993) J National Med Assoc. 85:931-9 Breast cancer risk factors in African - American women: the Howard University Tumor Resistry experience.

Laing et al (1994) Genetic Epidemiology 11:A300

Rohan et al. Am J Epidemiol 1988 Sep;128(3):478-89
A population-based case-control study of diet and breast cancer in Australia.

Bu et al. (1995) Am J Epidemiol 141:S85


Other Studies Which Show Increased Risk

Ye et al. (2002) Br J Cancer 87:977-981
Brinton et al. (1983) Br. Journal of Cancer 47:757-62
Reproductive factors in the etiology of breast cancer.

Rosenburg et al. (1988) Am J Epidemiology 127:981-9
Breast cancer in relation to the occurrence and time of induced and spontaneous abortion.

Marcus et al. Am J Public Health 1999 Aug; 89(8):1244-7
Adolescent reproductive events and subsequent breast cancer risk.

Palmer et al. (1997) Cancer Causes Control 8:841-9
Induced and spontaneous abortion in relation to risk of breast cancer.

Lazovich et al. Epidemiology 2000 Jan;11(1):76-80
Induced abortion and breast cancer risk.

Daling et al. Am J Epidemiol 1996 Aug 15;144(4):373-80
Risk of breast cancer among white women following induced abortion.

Daling et al. J Natl Cancer Inst 1994 Nov 2;86(21):1584-92
Risk of breast cancer among young women: relationship to induced abortion.

Laing et al. J Natl Med Assoc 1993 Dec;85(12):931-9
Breast cancer risk factors in African-American women: the Howard University Tumor Registry experience.

White et al. (1994) J Natl Cancer Inst 86:505-14
Breast cancer among young U.S. women in relation to oral contraceptive use.

Newcomb et al. (1996) JAMA 275:283-7
Pregnancy termination in relation to risk of breast cancer.

Howe et al. Int J Epidemiol 1989 Jun;18(2):300-4
Early abortion and breast cancer risk among women under age 40.

Andrieu et al. Br J Cancer 1995 Sep;72(3):744-51
Familial risk, abortion and their interactive effect on the risk of breast cancer--a combined analysis of six case-control studies.

Hirohata et al. (1985) Natl Cancer Inst Monogr 69:187-90
Occurrence of breast cancer in relation to diet and reproductive history: a case-control study in Fukuoka, Japan.

Ewertz & Duffy (1988) Br J Cancer 68:99-104
Risk of breast cancer in relation to reproductive factors in Denmark.

Lipworth et al. (1995) Int J Cancer 61:181-4
Abortion and the risk of breast cancer: a case-control study in Greece

Rookus & van Leeuwan J Natl Cancer Inst 88:1759-64
Induced abortion and risk for breast cancer: reporting (recall) bias in a Dutch case-control study

Talamini et al. (1996) Eur J Cancer 32A:303-10
The role of reproductive and menstrual factors in cancer of the breast before and after menopause

Watanabe & Hirayama (1968) Nippon Rinsho 26:1853-9 (in Japanese, no abstract available)

Dvoirin & Medvedev (1978) Meth Prog Breast Cancer Epidemiol Res, Tallin 1978. USSR
Acad Sci pp 53-63 (In Russian)

Le et al., (1984) British J Cancer 72:744-51

Luporsi (1988) British J Cancer 72:744-51

Wu et al. (1996) Br J Cancer 73:680-6

Robertson C, Van Den Donk M, Primic-Zakelj, MacFarlaneT, Boyle P. The association between induced and spontaneous abortion and risk of breast cancer in Slovenian women aged 25-54. Breast 2001; 10:291-8.


"And.."
Posted by bananapop 3 July  at  15:42

I'd like to see the studies where no link was found please?
"Ok fair enough"
Posted by gaelfish 3 July  at  17:14



I dont know if you have the patience for this, and sorry the fund raising foundation I mentioned earlier is Susan Komen, not Susan Coleman (Got my info from the radio, then did some research).

The pro abort groups maintain that women who have breast cancer are more likely to truthfully fess up to an abortion than women who are not sick. This is why (they say) that there 'appears' to be a link.

Even though a rat study demonstrated that more aborted rats exposed to the carcinogen, DMBA, develop breast cancer than virgin rats and rats having full term pregnancies. As one researcher sarcastically observed, rats dont give interviews, so that excludes the possibility that they furnished faulty reports of their abortion histories. [5]

also Tang et al. 2000 matched medical records with womens reports of their abortion histories to check for accuracy in reporting and concluded: "The authors' data do not suggest that controls (healthy women) are more reluctant to report a history of induced abortion than are women with breast cancer." [3]

Even though Melbye et al. 1997, a study anti-cancer groups and the abortion industry sing the praises of, fulfilled one of the six criteria used by scientists to determine a causal relationship. The study found a dose effect - meaning, the longer a woman is overexposed to estrogen before her abortion takes place, the greater her risk. [6]



Even though the Journal of the National Cancer Institute says breast cancer rates have risen precipitously - more than 40% since the procedure was legalized in 1973. The upturn has occurred exclusively among the women of the Roe v. Wade generation, not among older women. In 1973 the lifetime risk for the average American woman was 1 in 12. Now its 1 in 8. [8]



WHAT ANTI-CANCER GROUPS SAY ABOUT THE LINK



A conventional definition of scientific misconduct is to omit a fact so that what is stated or presented as a whole states or represents a material falsehood. Anti-cancer groups continue to rely on report bias theory to dismiss 29 studies reporting risk elevations, despite the complete lack of evidence that the phenomenon even exists in the ABC research. Their websites, moreover, dont provide a comprehensive list of the ABC studies. As a matter of fact, the citations they use are often almost exclusively limited to the much smaller number of studies they favor - the ones reporting no increased risk.



For instance, the Komen Foundation identifies three large cohort studies in support of its allegations that abortion does not cause breast cancer: Melbye et al. 1997, Harris et al. 1989 and the Iowa Womens Health Study. [9] Melbye et al. is strongly favored by all anti-cancer groups, although it has been shown to have misclassified 60,000 women whod had abortions as not having had abortions. Its researchers, furthermore, started counting cases of breast cancer recorded during a five year period before abortions were recorded. One quarter of the studys subjects were under age 25 - far too young for many to have developed the disease - and some were teenagers as young as age 14.



As for the Harris et al. study cited by Komen, it was proven in 1998 that this group of researchers covered up an abortion-breast cancer link among Norwegian women. [10,11] Its the same group which originally proposed the concept of report bias which has been widely used to discredit ABC studies. It is the group which in 1991, when its researchers tested for evidence of report bias, absurdly found 7 breast cancer patients who said theyd had abortions, but which the computer said theyd never had. The team found itself in the embarrassing position of having to argue that the 7 women either lied or over reported their abortions. [12] Consequently, in 1998 they withdrew their claim of having found credible evidence of report bias. [4]



Lazovich et al., one of the published reports of data from the Iowa Womens Health Study, reported a non-statistically significant 10% positive increase in risk. Lazovich et al. suffered from a low 42.7% participation rate. Fewer than half of the women randomly chosen to participate in the study responded to the studys recruitment questionnaire. The study subjects were between ages 55 and 69. Since all of the women in the study whod had abortions would have done so before legalization in 1973, they would be the ones most inclined not to respond to the questionnaire. Furthermore, 76% of the women in the study were excluded because of their histories of breast cancer. Although the purpose of the study was to follow the subjects breast cancer rates over time after the study began, its researchers were negligent not to have recorded the abortions among the breast cancer survivors kicked out of the study. [13]



The National Breast Cancer Coalition (NBCC) has deceptions on its website as well which we documented in our August 21, 2002 press release. [14] The NBCC even goes so far as to cite a study by a well known abortionist, David Grimes, M.D., who has a long record of attempts to debunk the ABC research in the United Nations and elsewhere. [15]



The Canadian Breast Cancer Foundation website claims there is no relationship between abortion and the disease, but provides no support for its statement. Its website says, Abortion, either miscarriage or voluntary, does not have an effect on cancer risk. [16] This is a half truth. Miscarriages, generally, do not increase risk, whereas abortions do.



The American Cancer Society says on its website: Research studies have not found a cause-and-effect relationship between breast cancer and abortion. . . .No link has been found between breast cancer and miscarriage or stillbirths. The research is not quite so clear with induced abortions and breast cancer.



On the contrary, there is staggering biological and epidemiological evidence of a causal relationship between abortion and the disease. A breast cancer surgeon affiliated with the Robert Wood Johnson School of Medicine, Angela Lanfranchi, M.D., F.A.C.S., moreover, argues that the six criteria used by scientists to determine a causal relationship have been fulfilled. Four medical organizations have come to recognize the overwhelming significance of this research. [17]



The Societys website includes the falsehood that studies show report bias has been a problem with the studies reporting a positive increase in risk. The web page sings the obligatory praises of the Melbye et al. 1997 study which is greatly favored by the abortion industry. Finally, it implies that ideological viewpoint provides some basis for the positive scientific findings, as if ideology were at all relevant to the issue. [18]

References 1) Howe et al. (1989) Int J Epidemiol 18:300-4. 2) Lipworth et al. (1995) Int J Cancer 61:181-4. 3) Tang et al. (2000) Am J Epidemiol 151:1139-43. 4) Meirik et al. (1998) J Epidemiol Community Health 52:209. 5) Russo and Russo (1980) Am J Pathology 100:497-512. 6) Melbye et al. N Engl J Med 1997 Jan 9; 336(2):81-5. 7) Melbye et al. Br J Cancer 1999 May;80(3-4):609-13. 8) Howe et al. (June 6, 2001) JNCI, Vol. 93. No. 11. 9) Susan G. Komen Breast Cancer Foundation website: <http://www.komen.org/bci/abc/dc/dc_11.asp> 10) Harris et al. (1989) British Med J 299:1430-2. 11) Brind et al. (1998) J Epidemiol Community Health 52:209-11. 12) Lindefors-Harris et al. (1991) Am J Epidemiol 134: 1003-1008. 13) Lazovich et al. (2000) Epidemiol 11:76-80. 14) Press Release, Coalition on Abortion/Breast Cancer, National Breast Cancer Coalition Chided for Politicizing Abortion-Breast Cancer Research, Attempts to Intimidate US Rep. Hostettler, August 21, 2002; <www.AbortionBreastCancer.c om>. 15) Bartholomew LL, Grimes DA. (1998) Obstet Gynecol Surv 53(11):708-14. 16) Canadian Breast Cancer Foundation website: <http://www.cbcf.org/what.html>





Never thought it would be meInformation for anyone struggling to make a decision about abortionPlease read and help if you can..Having an abortion on wednesday, advice needed ! Im not sure.....Concerned18 and pregnantI said i'd have an abortion but i don't want toIts all over!!!PriceAbortion again after 4 months.
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